Christmas shopping (merry christmas vs happy holidays)

[tn20]

I see both sides of the argument. I do NOT like stores going out of their way to avoid using Christmas in their advertisement. There is no such thing as a "Holiday tree," Holidays refers to all the Holidays that people celebrate this time of year, but there aren't Hannukah trees or Kwanzaa trees, there are Christmas trees. Call them that.

 

My issue is when Christmas trees are turned into Holiday trees, but Menorahs are still Menorahs. There are some stores who go out of their way to keep from "insulting" (or leaving out) other holidays, but are okay "insulting" (or leaving out) Christmas.

 

A TON of money enters the economy this time of year and the majority of it is Christmas related. Does that mean that Jewish people should be discluded from the decorations and well-wishes? No! Would I have a problem going into a store and finding it decorated for Hannukah? Only if Christmas had been removed from the store.

 

(BTW- I am a Christian and have many "Hannukah colors" decorating my tree and house... I find the colors to be beautiful!) Actually, every year I consider doing some kind of a Hannukah celebration- trying some of the traditional foods, playing games (dreidel anyone?), and learning and teaching my kids about the Jewish culture (which happens to be the culture of my Savior).

 

Hmm... maybe this year will be the year! *Off to find out when Hannukah falls this year*

[conj]

My issue is when Christmas trees are turned into Holiday trees, but Menorahs are still Menorahs. There are some stores who go out of their way to keep from "insulting" (or leaving out) other holidays, but are okay "insulting" (or leaving out) Christmas.

 

 

2 thoughts-

 

1) half the menorahs they display are decorative and can not be used by any religous Jew, so they are as much decoration as tinsel.

 

2) don't Pagans have trees for the solstice? What are they called?

[babymains]

Well the pagan question depends on whether you are speaking of wiccans or other non- judo christians. Wiccan or druids had the orginal chistmas tree, plus there is yule which falls like dec . 21.

There is the biggest reason for Happy holidays:

NOVEMBER 2009

1

All Saints' Day - Christian

Samhain * - Wicca Northern hemisphere

Beltane * - Wicca Southern hemisphere

2

All Souls' Day - Catholic Christian

Guru Nanak Dev Sahib birthday Sikh

12

Birth of Baha'u'llah * - Baha'i

15

Nativity Fast begins (through Dec 24) - Orthodox Christian

22

Christ the King - Christian

24

Guru Tegh Bahadur Martyrdom - Sikh

25-28

Hajj * - Islam

26

Thanksgiving - Interfaith - USA

Day of Covenant * - Baha'i

Waqf al Arafa - Hajj Day * ** - Islam

27

Eid al Adha * ** - Islam

28

Ascension of 'Abdu'l-Baha * Baha'i

29

First Sunday of Advent - Christian

30

Saint Andrew's Day - Christian

Definitions

 

DECEMBER 2009

6

Saint Nicholas Day - Christian

8

Bodhi Day (Rohatsu) ** - Buddhism

Immaculate Conception - Catholic Christian

12

Feast day - Our Lady of Guadalupe - Catholic Christian

Advent Fast begins - Orthodox Christian

12-19

Hanukkah * - Jewish

16-Dec 25

Posadas Navidenas - Christian

18

Hijra - New Year * ** - Islam

21 Solstice

Yule - Christian

Yule * - Wicca northern hemisphere

Litha * - Wicca southern hemisphere

25

Christmas * - Christian

26

Zarathosht Diso (Death of Prophet Zarathushtra ** - Zoroastrian

27

Feast of the Holy Family - Catholic Christian

Ashura * - Islam

28

Holy Innocents - Christian

31

Watch Night - Christian

 

Growing up Jewish people with other religions often told me more about their religion because I would not judge. So as you can see there are a lot of holidays in these two months.

[guilliam]

What I want to know is why you would come on a forum like this being a new member and post garbage to incite people and you knew that was going to happen. Black Friday has always been known as the beginning of the HOLIDAY SEASON. Not the beginning of the Christmas Season. And I believe you are wrong on people shopping for Christmas are the biggest spenders. Show me the statistics that prove what you are trying to preach here.

Well put Illinoismom:yup:. One of my biggest "pet peeves" is someone trying to push their religious beliefs on others. I believe that you should respect EVERYONE'S beliefs and religions/ non-religions. Don't push your beliefs on me and I won't push mine on you;)

 

I shop on BF to get good deals on items for Christmas, because we celebrate Christmas. But have no problem with Happy Holidays or whatever else you would like to wish me;) After all, whatever you say to me, you are still wishing me well. Some people need to get over themselves and enjoy their families instead of just looking for stuff to complain about:eyepoppin

[tn20]

2 thoughts-

 

1) half the menorahs they display are decorative and can not be used by any religous Jew, so they are as much decoration as tinsel.

 

2) don't Pagans have trees for the solstice? What are they called?

Just to be clear on what I meant (I don't want anyone to think that I have any issues with menorahs or any other religious item), I just used a menorah as an example of a religious item (decorative or otherwise) from a religion other than Christianity, and how some stores that I have been to, have no problem displaying or decorating with religious items from religions other than Christianity, but will not display "overtly Christian" items, such as the cross. Most stores, if they decorate for Christmas, it is with Santa Claus, but I have yet to see a cross (although I have seen many decorative Menorahs... they are not seen as offensive, but for some reason, a cross is). Christmas tree becomes Holiday tree, but Menorah does not become Holiday candelabra.

 

About Pagans and their trees, I would say that although Christians initially got the idea for the Christmas tree from pagan traditions, they are 2 separate things. There are Christmas trees and there are pagan trees. I don't think I've ever heard of a pagan going to the local Kmart, buying an artifical "Holiday tree" to use in their celebrations (not saying its never happened), but if you could sit down and talk to some high-up at WM, KM, Target or where ever, and ask them, "These trees that your company is selling, are you mass producing them, stocking hundreds per store, year after year, with the assumption that pagans will be buying them or because, year after year, Christians buy them for Christmas?" If you could get them to give an honest answer, its obvious that they are producing, marketing, decorating, selling, and profitting off of Christmas, and yet they refuse to call it what it is- a Christmas tree. Sure, some people may have different uses for it, but just because you use it for another purpose doesn't take away that it was produced with Christmas in mind.

 

If I go to your store to buy a Christmas tree with my hard-earned money, find out that you have re-dubbed said Christmas tree as a "Holiday tree" as to not offend anyone (What's so offensive about Christmas anyway? You don't believe, then don't celebrate it, that's fine, but there is nothing to be offended by.), then I'm going to walk back out and go somewhere where my religion and religious celebrations are not classified as "offensive."

 

My big complaint is simply stores expecting to profit off of Christmas, but find even the word "Christmas" too offensive to use in their marketing.

 

Well the pagan question depends on whether you are speaking of wiccans or other non- judo christians. Wiccan or druids had the orginal chistmas tree, plus there is yule which falls like dec . 21.

There is the biggest reason for Happy holidays:

NOVEMBER 2009

1

All Saints' Day - Christian

Samhain * - Wicca Northern hemisphere

Beltane * - Wicca Southern hemisphere

2

All Souls' Day - Catholic Christian

Guru Nanak Dev Sahib birthday Sikh

12

Birth of Baha'u'llah * - Baha'i

15

Nativity Fast begins (through Dec 24) - Orthodox Christian

22

Christ the King - Christian

24

Guru Tegh Bahadur Martyrdom - Sikh

25-28

Hajj * - Islam

26

Thanksgiving - Interfaith - USA

Day of Covenant * - Baha'i

Waqf al Arafa - Hajj Day * ** - Islam

27

Eid al Adha * ** - Islam

28

Ascension of 'Abdu'l-Baha * Baha'i

29

First Sunday of Advent - Christian

30

Saint Andrew's Day - Christian

Definitions

 

DECEMBER 2009

6

Saint Nicholas Day - Christian

8

Bodhi Day (Rohatsu) ** - Buddhism

Immaculate Conception - Catholic Christian

12

Feast day - Our Lady of Guadalupe - Catholic Christian

Advent Fast begins - Orthodox Christian

12-19

Hanukkah * - Jewish

16-Dec 25

Posadas Navidenas - Christian

18

Hijra - New Year * ** - Islam

21 Solstice

Yule - Christian

Yule * - Wicca northern hemisphere

Litha * - Wicca southern hemisphere

25

Christmas * - Christian

26

Zarathosht Diso (Death of Prophet Zarathushtra ** - Zoroastrian

27

Feast of the Holy Family - Catholic Christian

Ashura * - Islam

28

Holy Innocents - Christian

31

Watch Night - Christian

 

Growing up Jewish people with other religions often told me more about their religion because I would not judge. So as you can see there are a lot of holidays in these two months.

WOW! I can't even pronounce half of those...

[guilliam]

Stores don't find the word Christmas offensive, their customers who practice a different religion find the word Christmas offensive when it is pushed upon them. Which is what is being done when you say it to everyone. Happy Holidays includes everyone!! Just as you get upset when they don't say "Merry Christmas" to you, how would you feel if every store decided just to say "Happy Hanukkah"? Oh that's right, you wouldn't shop there. Which is WHY stores want to say "Happy Holidays" and include EVERYONE!!! Why do so many people have so much trouble with EVERYONE BEING INCLUDED in the well wishes. Celebrate your holiday and get over it already:rolleyes:

[darianwiccan]

For the life of me, I don't know why people have this problem. Both holidays are about miracles, Christmas being the day we celebrate the birth of Jesus and Hannukah celebrating the miracle of the oil in the lamps. Quanza (sp) is about the family and culture of African Americans, at least the best I know.

 

No matter which holiday we celebrate, let's be good to each other. There is way too much fighting in this old world right now. Lets not argue and and fight amongst ourselves on a web site that most people love. From Santaclaus to all of you:

 

Merry Christmas.

 

Happy Hannakah.

 

Happy Quanza.

 

I'm happy to admit that I am not a Christian. I am, in fact, a devout Wiccan Priest. But I am happy when I see "Merry Christmas" signs at stores. Be proud of your religion, and if nothing else, remember that whether you say Merry Christmas, Happy Chanukah, Happy Quanza, Blessed Yule, Happy Festivus, etc... you are participating in the spirit of good will that nearly everyone enjoys.

 

(even though it's pretty early still) I'd like to wish everyone a Happy ChristmaChunaKwanzaYule!

[tn20]

Stores don't find the word Christmas offensive, their customers who practice a different religion find the word Christmas offensive when it is pushed upon them. Which is what is being done when you say it to everyone. Happy Holidays includes everyone!! Just as you get upset when they don't say "Merry Christmas" to you, how would you feel if every store decided just to say "Happy Hanukkah"? Oh that's right, you wouldn't shop there. Which is WHY stores want to say "Happy Holidays" and include EVERYONE!!! Why do so many people have so much trouble with EVERYONE BEING INCLUDED in the well wishes. Celebrate your holiday and get over it already:rolleyes:

Maybe you should re-read my posts before you start assuming things about me and giving me the "eye roll." Neither of my posts say anything about having a problem with the phrase Happy Holidays! And actually, both of my boys have old Hebrew names and many people assume we are Jewish. I have been wished Happy Hannukah more times than I can count and what do I say back? Happy Hannukah to you, too!

 

I have tried to make it VERY clear that I am NOT AGAINST any religions being allowed to celebrate their Holidays. But calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree is by NO means offensive or pushing anything onto anyone! Just like calling a Menorah a Menorah is not offensive or trying to push Judasim on anyone.

 

I do not find Happy Hannukah, Happy Holidays, Happy Kwanzaa, or any other well-wish to be offensive in the least. I just wish that Christians were afforded the same as other religions and their Holiday greeting was not seen as "offensive" or as trying to "push their religion" on to someone else!

[tn20]

I'm happy to admit that I am not a Christian. I am, in fact, a devout Wiccan Priest. But I am happy when I see "Merry Christmas" signs at stores. Be proud of your religion, and if nothing else, remember that whether you say Merry Christmas, Happy Chanukah, Happy Quanza, Blessed Yule, Happy Festivus, etc... you are participating in the spirit of good will that nearly everyone enjoys.

 

(even though it's pretty early still) I'd like to wish everyone a Happy ChristmaChunaKwanzaYule!

Beautifully said! And a very Happy ChristmaChunaKwanzaYule to you, too!

[KrystalMae1231]

I can't believe I see this on here. This is what devides our nation. Although so many have great points and views on the subject, I still don't see the point. Other than athiest we are basically believe in the same thing. Lets remember that we all occupy this earth and will one day occupy Heaven or Hell. (Your Choice) Gottadeal.com is a place that we can all come together for one thing.......To not pay retail. This is a uniting site and I feel some of the posts are causing us to do what so many people in our nation do now. God teaches us to love and respect everyone no matter their religion, culture, color, or anything else that makes us who we are as human beings. We are all someones child and we all occupy this earth and we all come to this site for great deals. So lets, (despite our religious preferences), celebrate the holidays for what they are really about.........family and being thankful for everything we have.

:)

[guilliam]

Maybe you should re-read my posts before you start assuming things about me and giving me the "eye roll." Neither of my posts say anything about having a problem with the phrase Happy Holidays! And actually, both of my boys have old Hebrew names and many people assume we are Jewish. I have been wished Happy Hannukah more times than I can count and what do I say back? Happy Hannukah to you, too!

 

I have tried to make it VERY clear that I am NOT AGAINST any religions being allowed to celebrate their Holidays. But calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree is by NO means offensive or pushing anything onto anyone! Just like calling a Menorah a Menorah is not offensive or trying to push Judasim on anyone.

 

I do not find Happy Hannukah, Happy Holidays, Happy Kwanzaa, or any other well-wish to be offensive in the least. I just wish that Christians were afforded the same as other religions and their Holiday greeting was not seen as "offensive" or as trying to "push their religion" on to someone else!

I believe you said "My big complaint is simply stores expecting to profit off of Christmas, but find even the word "Christmas" too offensive to use in their marketing."

 

To which I replied "Stores don't find the word Christmas offensive, their customers who practice a different religion find the word Christmas offensive when it is pushed upon them."

 

Now, what part of that do I need to re-read????

 

A Pine Tree can be decorated and called whatever the owner would like to call it as far as I am concerned. After all, what did a tree have to do with Christ's Birthday?

[tn20]

Stores don't find the word Christmas offensive, their customers who practice a different religion find the word Christmas offensive when it is pushed upon them.

 

In regards to this part of your post, I don't believe that you misunderstood what I was trying to say. I just do not agree that calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree is in any way offensive or that it is "pushing" Christmas on anyone. Calling a Pagan tree of life a pagan tree of life is not offensive. Its what it is. And its not pushing anything on anyone.

 

Which is what is being done when you say it to everyone. Happy Holidays includes everyone!!

 

I don't believe I ever said that I had a problem with someone wishing me or anyone else Happy Holidays. I never said I wish everyone Merry Christmas, regardless of their beliefs. I probably say Happy Holidays as often as I say Merry Christmas.

 

Just as you get upset when they don't say "Merry Christmas" to you, how would you feel if every store decided just to say "Happy Hanukkah"? Oh that's right, you wouldn't shop there.

 

Where did I say that I get upset when someone doesn't say Merry Christmas to me? When did I say I wouldn't shop at a place that wished me Happy Hannukah? Like I said before, I've been wished Happy Hannukah numerous times and far from being upset, I wish them a Happy Hannukah, as well.

 

Which is WHY stores want to say "Happy Holidays" and include EVERYONE!!! Why do so many people have so much trouble with EVERYONE BEING INCLUDED in the well wishes.

Where did I say that I didn't want everyone being included in well wishes? I did not say that because I absolutely do not feel that way.

 

What I think you are misunderstanding from my posts, is that I don't feel like Christmas is the only Holiday that should be celebrated, BUT I do get upset when a store is decorated for countless other Holidays and celebrations, but when I ask where the Christmas trees are they reply, "The Holiday trees are on aisle XX." If I asked where the Menorahs were, they would not reply, "The Holiday candlabra are on aisle XX."

 

My issue is NOT with including all the Holidays and the people who celebrate them (that's a great idea), my issue is stores leaving all Holidays, but doing away with Christmas. Hannukah items are still Hannukah items, but Christmas items must be renamed, because CHRISTmas is offensive. Why is it only Christians who are accused of pushing their religion on people? Would a Jewish person saying, "Happy Hannukah!" to everyone be pushing their religion on people. I certainly don't think so. So I think that the "rules" should apply to everyone.

 

Celebrate your holiday and get over it already:rolleyes:

I have said nothing offensive in my posts, but your response to me is to "get over it already" and "roll your eyes." All I've done is given my opinion, which, simply put, is that there is nothing offensive about Christmas. That calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree is not pushing my religion on someone else. That if a store feels its ok to decorate for Hannukah, then they should feel its ok to decorate for Christmas. Whether the store heads believe in Christ or not, they should respect the fact that believers celebrating Christmas is critical to their bottom line. Equal treatment instead of this ongoing trend.

[guilliam]

In regards to this part of your post, I don't believe that you misunderstood what I was trying to say. I just do not agree that calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree is in any way offensive or that it is "pushing" Christmas on anyone. Calling a Pagan tree of life a pagan tree of life is not offensive. Its what it is. And its not pushing anything on anyone.

 

 

 

I don't believe I ever said that I had a problem with someone wishing me or anyone else Happy Holidays. I never said I wish everyone Merry Christmas, regardless of their beliefs. I probably say Happy Holidays as often as I say Merry Christmas.

 

 

 

Where did I say that I get upset when someone doesn't say Merry Christmas to me? When did I say I wouldn't shop at a place that wished me Happy Hannukah? Like I said before, I've been wished Happy Hannukah numerous times and far from being upset, I wish them a Happy Hannukah, as well.

 

 

 

Where did I say that I didn't want everyone being included in well wishes? I did not say that because I absolutely do not feel that way.

 

What I think you are misunderstanding from my posts, is that I don't feel like Christmas is the only Holiday that should be celebrated, BUT I do get upset when a store is decorated for countless other Holidays and celebrations, but when I ask where the Christmas trees are they reply, "The Holiday trees are on aisle XX." If I asked where the Menorahs were, they would not reply, "The Holiday candlabra are on aisle XX."

 

My issue is NOT with including all the Holidays and the people who celebrate them (that's a great idea), my issue is stores leaving all Holidays, but doing away with Christmas. Hannukah items are still Hannukah items, but Christmas items must be renamed, because CHRISTmas is offensive. Why is it only Christians who are accused of pushing their religion on people? Would a Jewish person saying, "Happy Hannukah!" to everyone be pushing their religion on people. I certainly don't think so. So I think that the "rules" should apply to everyone.

 

 

 

I have said nothing offensive in my posts, but your response to me is to "get over it already" and "roll your eyes." All I've done is given my opinion, which, simply put, is that there is nothing offensive about Christmas. That calling a Christmas tree a Christmas tree is not pushing my religion on someone else. That if a store feels its ok to decorate for Hannukah, then they should feel its ok to decorate for Christmas. Whether the store heads believe in Christ or not, they should respect the fact that believers celebrating Christmas is critical to their bottom line. Equal treatment instead of this ongoing trend.

It seems that you seem to think my whole post is just about you When I said "get over it" I mean everyone complaining that they aren't going to shop at a store because they won't say "Merry Christmas". By saying "Merry Christmas" it is leaving out all the other religions whereas "Happy Holidays" includes everyone.

And I stand by my statement that EVERYONE complaining about it needs to step back and see it from the other side (other religions) and GET OVER IT.

[tn20]

It seems that you seem to think my whole post is just about you

I did take your post as directed entirely at me, so I do apologize for that misunderstanding.

 

And like the very first sentence that I typed on this thread said...

I see both sides of the argument.

I did not vote that I would not shop in a store if they didn't say Merry Christmas. Saying Happy Holidays is wishing everyone a Happy Holiday, and to quote Darianwiccan "you are participating in the spirit of good will that nearly everyone enjoys."

 

But going out of your way to rename items to remove the word Christmas from the name is implying that Christmas is offensive. Why should I spend my money in a store that implies that anyone has a reason to be offended by the word Christmas? Just because someone does not celebrate Christmas does not mean that they should be offended by the word Christmas (especially because everyone knows that, despite what stores call them, they are still Christmas trees or whatever they were called before), just as someone who does not celebrate Hannukah, Kwanzaa, Yule, etc. should not be offended by them.

 

 

And whereas you say "GET OVER IT," I say healthy debate and conversation are perfectly fine. I can't imagine what this world would be like if everyone were told to "get over it" when they did not agree with someone or something. I have read a few posts that I certainly do not agree with and feel they were offensive and rude, but telling everyone who does not agree with you to just "GET OVER IT" could be considered as close-minded as you are accusing others of being.

[Catrinaf25]

BargainCat did you post just to get people in a argument and fighting? Your post (IMO) come off as very rude.

[Ravenseye]

Silly Nit to pick.

Samhain is on Halloween. Not Nov 1st. That's All Souls Day.

Thanks, and Merry ChrismaHanukkwanzika to you all!

 

And, to bring this to relevancy, I say Merry Christmas to everyone...and I'm a Pagan.

My friends who are either pagan or jews or what have you, get the appropriate greeting and card :)

 

Merry Christmas tends to generically cover what I want to say :)

 

And, working in retail and knowing a bit about the design side of things, just because a store (especially a big chain retail store) decorates in certain colors doesn't mean squat about what they are supporting or not supporting. They are following what color forecasters tell them are going to be the hot colors of the season.

 

-Mike

Edited October 10, 2009 by Ravenseye
christmas cheer :)

[gemini1567]

Double nit pick

 

Samhain - Samhain on November 1st - http://www.chalicecentre.net/samhain.htm

 

The Irish word Samhain is derived from the Old Irish samain, samuin, or samfuin, all referring to 1 November - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samhain

[aprncess]

As far as what people say at the store, sure I would like everyone to wish me Merry Christmas however I am not wearing a big sign that says what I celebrate therefore I do not expect them to say Merry Christmas. If they do fine, if they say Happy Holidays fine as well, my reply is always Merry Christmas and if by chance I happen to say it first, I say Merry Christmas and don't expect anyone to take offense because they are not wearing a great big sign that informs me as to what they celebrate. I shop anywhere there is a good deal even from home and take no offense to their well wishing no matter what they call it.

[KBsDarling]

I am just happy when the cashier says anything....maybe I have low standards LOL

 

I would much rather be told Happy Holidays, Happy Hanukkah, Merry Christmas, Blessed Be, or Happy Kwanzaa then ignored and filed trough the check out by a stressed out drone of a cashier. If someone said Happy Hanukkah to me(as a non-Jewish person) I would say "Thank you and to you as well" and be happy for the moment of polite that entered my day.

[olszanski]

I'm an atheist, and we celebrate "winter" as opposed to 'Christ's Birth' (which isn't even really the day of Christ's birth in the first place, but whatever.). I don't pay attention to whether stores say Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays or anything else for that matter. Personally, *I* say Happy Holidays because I like to be polite and acknowledge that not everybody's playing the role of a fat guy in a suit just because it's December.

 

I also don't just shop for the holidays on Black Friday... my oldest daughter's birthday is the beginning of January, so I take advantage of the extra deals during the season to stash back presents for her.

Wow, we learn something new every day. I had no idea atheists celebrated any holiday around Christmas time.

[tn20]

I am just happy when the cashier says anything....maybe I have low standards LOL

[katkat777]

I am just happy when the cashier says anything....maybe I have low standards LOL

 

I would much rather be told Happy Holidays, Happy Hanukkah, Merry Christmas, Blessed Be, or Happy Kwanzaa then ignored and filed trough the check out by a stressed out drone of a cashier. If someone said Happy Hanukkah to me(as a non-Jewish person) I would say "Thank you and to you as well" and be happy for the moment of polite that entered my day.

 

Soooo True!!