Official Black Friday TVs (HDTV & 4K) Discussion Thread

[Brad]

As always, we have several dedicated threads for the hotter items each Black Friday. Please try to keep all discussion related to these items in their official threads. Other threads posted will likely be merged into this main thread.

[jaymacfla]

I am hoping for a good deal on a 75 inch 4K TV this year!

[Kanyon71]

I'm hoping for a really good deal on a 50"-60" to put in our room. Wife keeps telling me the one in there isn't big enough now that we have the 70" in there.

[Pnambic]

Ah, my favorite thread...  

 

Cliff's notes:

 - Priority #1: Look for information on Quantum Dot and learn which manufacturers are doing good stuff there.

 - Keep a close eye on HDR.  Looks like it's at least down to two main players, HDR10 and Dolby Vision.  And while I think Dolby Vision is head and shoulders better, it looks like HDR10 has all the momentum at the moment (it's free - no licensing required for one thing).  IF you buy a 4K TV, don't buy one without HDR10 support, and get one that supports both if you want to play it safe.  And watch out for confusing acronyms and wording intended to make you assume the TV supports something it really doesn't.

 - Seriously folks, the amount of media out there in 4K in no way supports the notion that you need to upgrade your perfectly fine 1080P HDTV.  Remember how everything was going to be in 3D a couple years ago?  Yea, didn't happen.  Heck, there aren't even any 1080P broadcasts yet and that's been out for what, 10 years now?  4K is 99% gimmick to get you to buy a new television, and if you're going to buy a new television, may as well get one that's "future-proof".  Sorry, that's hogwash.  

 - Remember, you'll probably need to move your couch a few feet closer to your television in order to actually see the difference with that new 4K TV when you get it home. (Must read: http://carltonbale.com/1080p-does-matter/)

 - If you're dead set on getting a 4K TV set, I can't stop you.  People waste money on status symbols all the time.  I do too.  I just won't waste money on THIS status symbol.  

[jaymacfla]

Believe it or not, I would even go for a 75 inch 1080p deal if it also included 3D.

[jesusluvu]

Im in for a bigger TV this year. This will be my gift to me purchase

[rockpzazz]

Any predictions on 32 inch TV's?  I have a couple that work ok, but they are lower end so the color seems a bit messed up and would like to upgrade.  I don't care about getting anything bigger unless a 40 inch is within my budget.

 

Also are the TV's with the built in Roku's worth it or would it be better to just get a really good TV and a Roku separate?  I don't have a need for a Roku, but if they are good TV's I wouldn't be opposed to spending a bit more to have it included.

[Pnambic]

Any predictions on 32 inch TV's?  I have a couple that work ok, but they are lower end so the color seems a bit messed up and would like to upgrade.  I don't care about getting anything bigger unless a 40 inch is within my budget.

 

Also are the TV's with the built in Roku's worth it or would it be better to just get a really good TV and a Roku separate?  I don't have a need for a Roku, but if they are good TV's I wouldn't be opposed to spending a bit more to have it included.

 

Each year, we see a couple at the low end, door busters if you will, a couple at the high end for those shoppers with money to spend and higher standards and then a majority of the deals in the middle.

 

 - In 2013, the low end was $100, the middle was $210 - $230 and the high end was $270 - $300.  Roughly 75% of the deals fell in those three buckets, 50% in the middle.

 - In 2014, the low end was $100, the middle was $170 - $200 and the high end was $240 - $250.  Roughly 85% of the deals fell in those three buckets, 50% in the middle.

 - In 2015, the low end was $80, the middle was $170 - $200 and the high end was $220 - $230.  Roughly 60% of the deals fell in those three buckets, 40% in the middle.

 

http://i1089.photobucket.com/albums/i353/pnambic/32%20Chart_zpsxa7rynyr.png

 

So, my predictions?  The prices will probably be very similar to 2015, but we'll see more features (like Roku and other smart features).

 - Probably low end of $80 again, middle from $170 - $180 and a high end around $200 - $220.

 

You probably won't find 4K on 32" TV's as you'd need to be about 2 ft or closer in order to see the difference.  Hard to sell that even in the aisles in the store.  In my mind, it's not worth it on anything but computer monitors, but certainly not worth it on smaller TV's.

 

You might try checking avsforums to see about maybe tweaking your TV's color, contrast, sharpness and other settings for both your existing TV's as well as any you purchase in the future.  They're pretty good about posting optimal settings for tons of TV's.

 

A generation ago, they were making TV's with built in VCR's.  And then TV's with built in DVD players.  Generally, they weren't the better examples of either technology.  But today, built in Roku and Netflix and Amazon Prime etc, are basically just apps, and they can even be updated.  These really are added value for most people...IF you're going to use it.  I know a lot of people who have just shown zero interest in streaming media.  If you're not interested in using it, why pay for it?  But if you are interested in using it, they are nice features to have.

Edited October 7, 2016 by Pnambic

[bluebear]

We have had a Roku TV. It was fine. We got a really good deal on Amazon when they were fairly new. When the kid went to college last year, we sent it with him, and bought a new regular TV for us. It worked great for him. The biggest thing is that you need the remote it comes with for the initial setup, and after that either that remote or a phone app. Universal and programmable remotes won't work, at least for the one we had.

[laddhorn]

As 4K seems to be the thing....

 

I own a 4K TV that is big enough that I can see the difference.  I purchased it so I could use it partially as a computer monitor.  The only 4K content that is out requires a special DVD player ($300+) and special DVDs.  I'm actually trying to move away from the DVD format and go fully digital (partially why I have a computer hooked to it), so no need for DVDs for me.  That leaves the "up-scaling" that the TV does.  I'm not sure if I like the look of the up-scaled shows.  It looks like you can see the set.  Everything in the background of the character appears fake.  I'm sure that the quality of the cameras and how they filmed it has something to do with that, and eventually it will catch up.  If you still use DVDs and are NOT going to use it as a computer monitor, a 4K TV is not necessary.  Save yourself some money and pick up a 1080p TV instead.

[Kanyon71]

I'm 1080p until 16k tv's hit the market. Then I'm all over those (probably not but it will be time to replace my current group by then lol)

 

Our TV purchase this year is only going to be in the 50"-60" range so no need for anything above 1080p for me. Not to mention none of the video sources I use support 4K anyway and I have no plans on replacing those anytime soon.

Edited October 11, 2016 by Kanyon71

[len_mullen]

Ah, my favorite thread...  

 

Cliff's notes:

 - Priority #1: Look for information on Quantum Dot and learn which manufacturers are doing good stuff there.

 - Keep a close eye on HDR.  Looks like it's at least down to two main players, HDR10 and Dolby Vision.  And while I think Dolby Vision is head and shoulders better, it looks like HDR10 has all the momentum at the moment (it's free - no licensing required for one thing).  IF you buy a 4K TV, don't buy one without HDR10 support, and get one that supports both if you want to play it safe.  And watch out for confusing acronyms and wording intended to make you assume the TV supports something it really doesn't.

 - Seriously folks, the amount of media out there in 4K in no way supports the notion that you need to upgrade your perfectly fine 1080P HDTV.  Remember how everything was going to be in 3D a couple years ago?  Yea, didn't happen.  Heck, there aren't even any 1080P broadcasts yet and that's been out for what, 10 years now?  4K is 99% gimmick to get you to buy a new television, and if you're going to buy a new television, may as well get one that's "future-proof".  Sorry, that's hogwash.  

 - Remember, you'll probably need to move your couch a few feet closer to your television in order to actually see the difference with that new 4K TV when you get it home. (Must read: http://carltonbale.com/1080p-does-matter/)

 - If you're dead set on getting a 4K TV set, I can't stop you.  People waste money on status symbols all the time.  I do too.  I just won't waste money on THIS status symbol.  

 

Excellent post.  I always look forward to your posts (even if I disagree with some).  This one, however, is dead on.  My only caveat (and we discussed this last year) would be that given the price of UHD sets and the fact that they DO look great, I would not disqualify one simply because the tech remains unsettled.  As always, the consumer should but the set which looks best within their budget.

 

(I still have not seen a television which makes my 60" plasma look dated.)

[Megara211]

I'm really hoping that a 50"- 60" smart tv goes on sale for a good price. Or even a 3D tv without the smart feature.

And a 32" for my dad.

[Elmck]

We are not a a big TV watching family, but I am trying to talk to DH into a newer model. Ours is an antique!!! So I am hoping for a 40" at a great price, otherwise he'll say ours still works. 

[Megara211]

We are not a a big TV watching family, but I am trying to talk to DH into a newer model. Ours is an antique!!! So I am hoping for a 40" at a great price, otherwise he'll say ours still works.

 

oh I hear you! I'm trying to get my parents to agree to replace the tv in our living room. My dad's all its a good tv it was top of the line when we bought it. Dad it's old! It's older than my neices and nephews (who are entering their teens). Now he's saying well let's fix the other big tv. You mean the one that's 8 years old? I'm really, really hoping that one that size is on sale for a good price.

[jaymacfla]

Every year, people think that they know what size of TV they need but do not consider the location and distance from the set. Further complicating this is the distance from the TV to the seat is shorter as you climb up the resolution chart, especially 4K. Have you visited the Magnolia store within a Best Buy recently? The seat or couch is conspicuously close to the TV.   http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/by-size/size-to-distance-relationship .

 

Above is the link for the site that allows you to calculate the specific distance needed for optimal viewing, based upon the picture being viewed. Let's take a 65 inch tv for example:

 

480p: 23.2 ft

720p: 12.6 ft

1080p: 9.1 ft

4K ultra: 6.2 ft

 

Obviously, it would be foolish to calculate the distance based upon the lowest resolution, but it does give you an idea of the distance change from 1080p to 4K. This is important because you may be setting yourself up a specific room by design, and you need to know these things before making a purchase which may not yield a good outcome.

 

Let's say that you have set your room up with this 65inch tv. If you jump to a 75 inch 4k, you are only able to move the seat or couch .9 ft or 7.1 ft total away from the set for optimal use at 4K. if you are primarily using it for 1080p viewing, then you would still have to slide that couch back over a foot. Certain factors may come into play like the sets ability to properly upscale or simulate from the source.

 

Along with distance, you have to center the tv so that you are not in an uncomfortable position with your head being in an unnatural position while viewing the tv. This is why over the fireplace installations are a bad idea. Your distance is also important because you want your eyes to capture the screen only, keeping you from seeing a small rectangle on a large wall in your peripheral.

[bribri25]

When will realistically be the last year we see an abundance of 1080p TVs on sale for BF?  I feel like this may be the last year as I see more and more deals for 4K TVs than 1080p (even if the media and content hasn't yet caught up). And I'm thinking more of the big name brands (Samsung, LG, Sony, etc.).  I'm semi in the market for a new TV soon, but could wait til next year if those TVs will still be around and have even lower prices as 4K becomes even more popular.

[jesusluvu]

When will realistically be the last year we see an abundance of 1080p TVs on sale for BF?  I feel like this may be the last year as I see more and more deals for 4K TVs than 1080p (even if the media and content hasn't yet caught up). And I'm thinking more of the big name brands (Samsung, LG, Sony, etc.).  I'm semi in the market for a new TV soon, but could wait til next year if those TVs will still be around and have even lower prices as 4K becomes even more popular.

 

Not sure either. 1080P is already so cheap during the year that Black Friday would be super cheap. I want a 4K but a lot of the post has made me think and now I'm on the fence. It is a good thing and that's why I LOVE  Gottadeal because other few points can always open your eyes when you other wise would be making a big mistake and waste a ton of money.  But I am on the same lines as you 1-2 more years max I believe. 

[Kanyon71]

My thought is if the deal is really good and makes no sense to go 1080P then you may as well go 4K. Seems more devices (consoles and such) are coming out to support it so while you may not see much a difference in most things the deal is the difference to me.

[Pnambic]

Folks, 1080P isn't going anywhere anytime soon.  Any and all reports of its impending demise are grossly exaggerated.

 

Recall if you would all the 3D HDTV's that were all over the place the last few years.  There was more media available in 3D than there currently is in 4K and 3D still didn't make it.  If I were to place a bet, I'd say we were still easily 6 - 10 years away from 4K getting to the point where it has even half the marketshare of published media.  And chances are great that something even better will come out between now and then.

[bribri25]

Okay, I agree 1080p isn't doing anywhere. But I'm thinking of 2-3 ish years ago (before we really got to reasonably-priced 4K) when there were 720p deals were few and far between and 90% of the TVs on BF were 1080p. This year (yes, I know we only have Dell Home ad to go by so far, but if that's any indication...) 60% (based on a sample size of 5 TVs in the ad ;-) ) of the TVs are 4K; 40% HD. The past few years you've been able to say... "I want a 60" Samsung 1080p TV" and it'd be on a BF sale somewhere; or "I want a 55" LG 1080p TV" and it'd be on a BF sale somewhere. Every brand, every size; there was a plethora of deals for your preference of brand and size.  Now, 4K is taking over and I don't want to lose the chance of having the flexibility in picking the deal I want for a 1080p TV when most of the deals are on 4K.

 

That being said, Kanyon makes a good point that the price point gap is closing and while there may not be as many sales on 1080p next year, you're not going to pay that much more for 4K so why not. Sure, it won't gain you much quality in 75% of viewing cases (not a large enough screen or sitting close enough, and the content likely isn't even 4K), but if you're only paying 15-20% more (and potentially even less difference by next year) then why not?

[Kanyon71]

In the ad's so far I'm seeing a LOT of 4K sales. Seem to be outweighing the 1080P so far. Not a lot of ad's yet to be positive but usually most of the major ones tend to follow each other in these trends.

[bribri25]

And just taking for instance the BJs ad; Samsung, 50", 4K (Page 2) and 1080p (Page 3) are fairly comparable where you're paying $480 for 4K and 25% less for 1080p ($350).  To me, 25% savings is worth it at this point, but maybe that gap closes again in another year, as well as the number of deals on 1080p TVs diminishes (as we're seeing already).

[DaFees]

Since I was researching this information for a friend of mine I thought I would share what I found here as well.

 

As mentioned above not all 4K TVs are created equal. While most will support HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2, thus allowing for 4K Ultra HD Blu-Ray playback, via a compatible player. Not all 4K TVs support HDR10, which again, as mentioned above, seems to be the leading standard so far.

 

For those of you in the market for a 4K TV some of you may also be in the market for a 4K Ultra HD Blu-Ray player and so far the Xbox One S reigns supreme on that front. With this in mind it would be helpful to know which TVs actually support the standard, HDR10. Thankfully a user on Reddit maintains a list of the lines of TVs that support HDR10. (Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/xboxone/comments/4vojfu/list_of_tvs_fully_compatible_with_hdr10_for_xbox/)

 

To save readers here the trouble I will share the list here.

 

 

Model Year: 2016

LG OLED E6

LG OLED G6

LG OLED B6

LG OLED C6

LG UH9500

LG UH8500

LG UH7700

Samsung KS9800

Samsung KS9500/KS9000

Samsung KS8500/KS8000

Sony X940D

Sony X930D

Sony X850D

Vizio P-Series (C1) (Firmware update has been released)

 

Model Year: 2015

LG OLED EF9500

Samsung JS9500

Samsung JS9000

Samsung JS8500

Sony X930C

Sony X900C

Sony X850C

 

NOTE: That list only includes TV lines/series known to already support the standard, HDR10. It does not include TVs that have announced firmware updates in the pipeline coming to support HDR10.

 

Now I haven't looked yet to see if any of those TVs are on sale yet but if you want to get the most out of your games and Ultra HD Blu-Rays one of those TVs would be one of the ones to get.

[Khobbs1]

Looking for a 32 or less than 40ish, for bedrooms, smart would be nice, but not a requirement. Just a basic good old fashion television for, old fashion tv watching or maybe play a video game. Nothing elaborate, I'm not an audiophile or videophile so, maybe using , dare I say it, "rabbit ears". Sometimes simple can be a good thing

[Pnambic]

And just taking for instance the BJs ad; Samsung, 50", 4K (Page 2) and 1080p (Page 3) are fairly comparable where you're paying $480 for 4K and 25% less for 1080p ($350).  To me, 25% savings is worth it at this point, but maybe that gap closes again in another year, as well as the number of deals on 1080p TVs diminishes (as we're seeing already).

 

Yup

 

I know I've linked to this website before but I'll do it again as they seem to put out some really great info.

http://www.rtings.com/

 

In particular, looking at the 4K TV BriBri referenced above, they found that while it will accept a 4K signal, and even says it supports HDR10, it doesn't actually support a Wide Color Gamut, which is the best part of 4K HDR media.  

http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/ku6300

 

And again, the box says "Motion Rate 120", but the set is actually still just a 60Hz refresh rate.

[tjhollis]

Yup

 

I know I've linked to this website before but I'll do it again as they seem to put out some really great info.

http://www.rtings.com/

 

In particular, looking at the 4K TV BriBri referenced above, they found that while it will accept a 4K signal, and even says it supports HDR10, it doesn't actually support a Wide Color Gamut, which is the best part of 4K HDR media.  

http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/ku6300

 

And again, the box says "Motion Rate 120", but the set is actually still just a 60Hz refresh rate.

 

 

 

This is where they confuse a lot of people. They see motion rate 120 and think its 120Hz.

Edited November 4, 2016 by tjhollis

[len_mullen]

Each year, we see a couple at the low end, door busters if you will, a couple at the high end for those shoppers with money to spend and higher standards and then a majority of the deals in the middle.

 

 - In 2013, the low end was $100, the middle was $210 - $230 and the high end was $270 - $300.  Roughly 75% of the deals fell in those three buckets, 50% in the middle.

 - In 2014, the low end was $100, the middle was $170 - $200 and the high end was $240 - $250.  Roughly 85% of the deals fell in those three buckets, 50% in the middle.

 - In 2015, the low end was $80, the middle was $170 - $200 and the high end was $220 - $230.  Roughly 60% of the deals fell in those three buckets, 40% in the middle.

 

http://i1089.photobucket.com/albums/i353/pnambic/32%20Chart_zpsxa7rynyr.png

 

So, my predictions?  The prices will probably be very similar to 2015, but we'll see more features (like Roku and other smart features).

 - Probably low end of $80 again, middle from $170 - $180 and a high end around $200 - $220.

 

You probably won't find 4K on 32" TV's as you'd need to be about 2 ft or closer in order to see the difference.  Hard to sell that even in the aisles in the store.  In my mind, it's not worth it on anything but computer monitors, but certainly not worth it on smaller TV's.

 

You might try checking avsforums to see about maybe tweaking your TV's color, contrast, sharpness and other settings for both your existing TV's as well as any you purchase in the future.  They're pretty good about posting optimal settings for tons of TV's.

 

A generation ago, they were making TV's with built in VCR's.  And then TV's with built in DVD players.  Generally, they weren't the better examples of either technology.  But today, built in Roku and Netflix and Amazon Prime etc, are basically just apps, and they can even be updated.  These really are added value for most people...IF you're going to use it.  I know a lot of people who have just shown zero interest in streaming media.  If you're not interested in using it, why pay for it?  But if you are interested in using it, they are nice features to have.

 

Dell Home Vizio 32" D-Series LED HDTV $129.99 Kohl's Hisense 32" 720p LED TV $119.99

[wittenlover]

Now that a lot of the big ads are out, I'm considering upgrading to a 50" TV... That said, I'm liking what I'm seeing on the Samsung 50" 4K TV in the Best Buy ad. Anybody have this model (or one in the series, maybe different size) that likes to watch sports? I'm curious because, being an avid NASCAR and football fan, I want one that can handle the fast action of the race and the action on the field. My current TV is kind of sub-par in that department. 

Worthy of note:

- I have a TV stand that sits in a corner (designed for corner usage) and the pedestal base on this Samsung is just small enough to fit without me having to buy a new stand, something I'd rather not do right now.

- Wall mount is not an option for me because of where the TV will be located.

- Not opposed to DIY'ing a mount onto the back of the corner stand (the stand is a combo of solid wood and glass), if that's something within the realm of possibility. (Just would need guidance on where to look for DIY instructions for such a project.)

 

Also, if you think one of the other TVs on offer would be better for this, I'm open to suggestion. I could go as large as a 55" in the corner where the TV will be without overwhelming the space.

[Kanyon71]

From the wording on the specs for that TV it's probably a 60Hz Refresh Rate with some software in the TV to try and smooth it out. It might be ok it's a good brand name so it's more likely to look a little nicer and smoother than some of the low end stuff. The LG in the AD is the same and is available for $2 more right now. Someone in the BB thread said they bought that one and will be picking it up tonight. I asked them for a review on it because it's one of the ones we are thinking about getting along with Vizio from the Sam's ad and the Samsung in this BB ad.

 

We will be using this TV in our bedroom and I know the one I have in there now (Vizio 42" from BF Sams 2 years ago) does pretty darn good with watching the Lions games lol.