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Upgrade Or New Black Friday Computer???

deelite

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deelite

deelite

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Ok guys...I am in a situation. I just bought my son Thrillville for his pc. The game won't work because the video card is a Nvidia Geforce4 MX instead of a Geforce4 TI (in other words it is just a lil bit shy of meeting the min. requirements). I looked around and to get the video card just to make it work will be about $50. Ok, this is where it gets complicated, the memory is only 512 mb and on certain games it freezes. So I researched memory for it and to get it up to the min. requirements, it will be about $150. That is just to get it up to 1gb. Sooo..so far I am looking at at least $200 worth of upgrades JUST to make the computer meet the min. requirements. Other than those issues the computer is fine. I am worried that this is just the tip of the iceburg, cause new games will come out and be too much for this 6 year old pc. Should I upgrade my Dell computer or get a new (probably will be an Emachines) one from BF? The ones on BF will be basic by todays standards, but probably have more than I would upgrade mine with. Probably will come with at least 2gb of memory and a newer video card. But it will be probably be an Emachines brand, which scares me a little..lol. With my Dell I know what I am working with, but it is old.

 

 

Should I upgrade my Dell computer or get a new (probably will be an Emachines) one from BF?

 

 

BTW... I already spent $45 upgrading it last year to get it to 512 mb. :blush:

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len_mullen

len_mullen

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The cost of an inexpensive game machine will be ~$400 if you can salvage your display. That's $300 for a Vista Home Premium computer with a 2+g cpu, 2+g of ram, a 300+g disk, and a pci-e slot plus $40 for a suitable power supply and $60 for a suitable video card. You will find these machines on BF or you can just shop the bargain sites.

 

In fact, just buy what you need right now...

 

1) Computer ($250+shipping)

2) Video Card 9400gt ($60 after $10 rebate, free shipping)

3) Power Supply ($50 after $20 rebate)

 

This PC is fine, but the disk is only 160g (big enough except for video editing, imho) and the OS is Vista Basic. You need to decide if you want Premium features. Merry Christmas. Get a big lcd on BF.

 

Edited to get all parts from Frys for ease of purchase. Shipping was $15 for me, so $390 OTD minus $30 in rebates = $360. Benchmarks for the 9400 are here.

Edited by len_mullen
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deelite

deelite

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To be perfectly honest I wouldn't upgrade your current computer or buy an eMachines on BF, if gaming is important.

 

What's your budget?

 

Well, it is more for mini gaming...lol. My son won't be playing anything like Half Life or WOW, but he does play pc games and Toontown. But I am not going into the thousands for 9 year old. So what should I do?? He just wants to play his basic games without getting frozen or told that he does not meet min. requirements. So not really a budget, but not over a few hundred. Sticky situation I know....:o

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deelite

deelite

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The cost of an inexpensive game machine will be ~$400 if you can salvage your display. That's $300 for a Vista Home Premium computer with a 2+g cpu, 2+g of ram, a 300+g disk, and a pci-e slot plus $40 for a suitable power supply and $60 for a suitable video card. You will find these machines on BF or you can just shop the bargain sites.

 

In fact, just buy what you need right now...

 

1) Computer ($250+shipping)

2) Video Card 9400gt ($60 after $10 rebate, free shipping)

3) Power Supply ($50 after $20 rebate)

 

This PC is fine, but the disk is only 160g (big enough except for video editing, imho) and the OS is Vista Basic. You need to decide if you want Premium features. Merry Christmas. Get a big lcd on BF.

 

Edited to get all parts from Frys for ease of purchase. Shipping was $15 for me, so $390 OTD minus $30 in rebates = $360. Benchmarks for the 9400 are here.

But isn't this still a very basic pc, pretty much what may be offered for BF?

 

 

I would just buy a new one.

 

I'm still torn if I want to upgrade this BF, just waiting for the Fry's ad. I only need a new motherboard, memory and CPU. And maaaaaaaaybe a video card.

 

Lol....only a new motherboard..isn't that the brains? So your pc needs a needs a new brain along with everything else....:cheesy:

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mysticmage

mysticmage

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Well, it is more for mini gaming...lol. My son won't be playing anything like Half Life or WOW, but he does play pc games and Toontown. But I am not going into the thousands for 9 year old. So what should I do?? He just wants to play his basic games without getting frozen or told that he does not meet min. requirements. So not really a budget, but not over a few hundred. Sticky situation I know....:o

How long do you believe your current system is going to last you? If your guess is below 2-3 years, you are best aiming for a new computer. If not, get a video card and/or use the program I recommended, it will really help speed games up and allow them to run on any video card.

Edited by mysticmage
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len_mullen

len_mullen

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But isn't this still a very basic pc, pretty much what may be offered for BF?

No. It's a PC running a modern operating system with good security. It is powerful enough to run that OS well, and, by upgrading the video card, can run current games -- most at the top settings.

 

My specs for a Vista PC (I think everyone should be running Vista; I have three Vista machines myself -- two are very close to this one) are...

 

goal: WEI ~5

 

cpu: >= 2g

ram: >= 2g

video: >= 8600gt

 

a machine that meets the hardware specs will achieve the goal of WEI=5 and that machine will do a lot of things well. the machine I spec'd will be cpu bound, so the next upgrade would be cpu + gpu. we'll do that when the kids have trouble playing whatever game is on the horizon. what i spec'd for you will be a good platform for ten years assuming you can pop in a new cpu and gpu as their prices come down.

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laddhorn

laddhorn

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Computer[/url] ($250+shipping)

2) Video Card 9400gt ($60 after $10 rebate, free shipping)

3) Power Supply ($50 after $20 rebate)

 

].

I wouldn't worry about the Power Supply or the Video Card. The integrated video will work fine for 99% of the games a 6yr old will play.

 

I would pick up an inexpensive Computer and just go with it. A Vista computer needs 2GB of RAM. For a 6yr old, one of these plain-jane computers will work perfect. When they get old enough to need upgrades, it will be better just to get a new one then.

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len_mullen

len_mullen

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I also have some older machines that would work for you, but the cost of the agp cards i bought for them (assuming you have an agp slot) has crept up as the cost of a vista machine has fallen, so it's tough for me to urge you to spend money on a card and psu for your machine.

 

If you want to look into that, post the complete specs of your machine -- especially system board (at least what slots are available) and power supply (especially wattage).

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len_mullen

len_mullen

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I wouldn't worry about the Power Supply or the Video Card. The integrated video will work fine for 99% of the games a 6yr old will play.

I don't know what a six year old plays -- let alone what he will be playing in five years, but adding that video card and power supply brings the WEI up from ~3 to ~5 -- and that is a dramatic improvement no matter what you use the machine for. It would be foolish not to spend the $110 if one was capable of doing the simple installation.

 

It's a really great video card.

 

That said, adding a video card later is not a bad strategy if it is not immediately necessary. My Vista machine that is not up to the specs I listed is running integrated video and I use it as my everyday machine. It's just not a good gaming machine.

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deelite

deelite

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If you had a newer/modern computer you could easily upgrade 2GB RAM and guess how much it would cost you?

 

$19.99 after rebate

http://shop3.frys.com/product/5586870

So wait I can hunt down memory from just about anywhere? I have been looking for ones like the ones that came in the pc. These are the ones on Ebay:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dell-Dimension-8200-8100-1GB-2x512MB-Memory-PC800-RDRAM_W0QQitemZ350115906296QQihZ022QQcategoryZ11152QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

Dell Dimension 8200 8100 1GB 2x512MB Memory PC800 RDRAM and that is just for 1gb!! The pc can only go up to 2gb so I would rather do the whole 2gb.

 

Ok..So if I wanted to replace my memory and it not be Dell brand, how do I know which for my pc? Also how to pick a good cheap video card? I install all of my own stuff, but I am not pc smart. If some one tells me what to buy I can put in it in, I just don't know what to buy...lol! :cheesy:

 

 

So does everyone agree NO Black Friday pc for gaming?? Either buy a new totally different pc or upgrade my exsisting one? :smart:

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deelite

deelite

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How long do you believe your current system is going to last you? If your guess is below 2-3 years, you are best aiming for a new computer. If not, get a video card and/or use the program I recommended, it will really help speed games up and allow them to run on any video card.

 

I would probably last for another 2-3 years, but he would not be able to play the newer game. Wizard 101 and Toontoown already lag like crazy (Toontown has a leaking memory prob that they are aware of). And Thillville told him that his video card does not meet min requirements. But I hate to just throw this one to the dump, but looks like I have very little choice. Unless I spend boo koo bucks to upgrade it, sounds like he won't be playing. Can't really afford a new higher end pc. :(

 

 

I also have some older machines that would work for you, but the cost of the agp cards i bought for them (assuming you have an agp slot) has crept up as the cost of a vista machine has fallen, so it's tough for me to urge you to spend money on a card and psu for your machine.

 

If you want to look into that, post the complete specs of your machine -- especially system board (at least what slots are available) and power supply (especially wattage).

I have no idea what an agp slot is, what is the real name for it?? It is also a Windows XP service pack 3 version. I was told to stay away from upgrading to Vista for as long as possible.

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len_mullen

len_mullen

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I don't think anyone said that. I think we all agree that investing more in your existing system is not a good idea. I think most would agree that getting a Vista platform is the right solution. I think we all agree that such a platform will be available on BF but acknowledge that BF-like deals are available right now. Whether or not you should build a gaming PC right now seems to be the only thing there are different ideas about.

 

Personally, I would need to save $50 or more to stand in line on BF -- leaning towards the or more. I think you can shop without passion and get at least as good a deal right now.

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laddhorn

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I don't think anyone said that. I think we all agree that investing more in your existing system is not a good idea. I think most would agree that getting a Vista platform is the right solution. I think we all agree that such a platform will be available on BF but acknowledge that BF-like deals are available right now. Whether or not you should build a gaming PC right now seems to be the only thing there are different ideas about.

 

Personally, I would need to save $50 or more to stand in line on BF -- leaning towards the or more. I think you can shop without passion and get at least as good a deal right now.

I totaly agree! Invest in a new computer now. It doesn't have to be awesome or anything. The one suggested above should work fine. You CAN do the upgrades later. It isn't needed for it to work for you currently.

 

There isn't anything wrong with Vista. It's just DIFFERENT!! If you have ancient (in the electronics sence) printers/scanners, then you won't be able to use them. That is about the only problem it really has. Just make sure you have plenty of memory.

 

You can look at it this way: Upgrade your computer now. SPend $200. Next year when he wants a new game that is too much for your computer, you purchase one at $250-$300. Total spent in 2 years: $500

 

OR

 

Buy the new computer now. Spend $250-$300. Next year when he wants a new game....it works! 2-3 years from now you upgrade the computer in pieces at cheap prices.

Total spent in 2 years: $250-$400

 

Which would you prefer to do?

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shadowsjc

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So wait I can hunt down memory from just about anywhere? I have been looking for ones like the ones that came in the pc. These are the ones on Ebay:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/Dell-Dimension-8200-8100-1GB-2x512MB-Memory-PC800-RDRAM_W0QQitemZ350115906296QQihZ022QQcategoryZ11152QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

Dell Dimension 8200 8100 1GB 2x512MB Memory PC800 RDRAM and that is just for 1gb!! The pc can only go up to 2gb so I would rather do the whole 2gb.

 

Ok..So if I wanted to replace my memory and it not be Dell brand, how do I know which for my pc? Also how to pick a good cheap video card? I install all of my own stuff, but I am not pc smart. If some one tells me what to buy I can put in it in, I just don't know what to buy...lol! :cheesy:

 

 

So does everyone agree NO Black Friday pc for gaming?? Either buy a new totally different pc or upgrade my exsisting one? :smart:

i have a 7 year old dell dimension as my home PC that my mom uses primarily. it uses the same crap RDRAM that is tons more expensive than the newer stuff. it also had that annoying loud fan problem that seems to be common with the dell dimensions, but i managed to fix that with a new fan.

 

the only thing ive thrown at this pc is a larger hard drive that i got for free from my uncle, and some new RAM. right now, the PC runs like crap for anything other than basic internet and music. i just bought 256 MB more RAM from ebay for $17. im gonna install it this week - if it manages to improve the quality of this PC noticeably, i'll keep it. otherwise ill just spend the $300 or so for a new one on BF.

 

if your intention is to extend the life of the PC any more, i wouldnt bother. with most old PC's, you can throw on 1 or 2 gb of RAM , and it will fix things up quite a bit. with PC's that use RDRAM, however, it is too cost prohibitive to upgrade, and you're alot better off just buying a new one.

 

Edit - if you do get one with windows vista, make sure you have at least 2 GB of RAM installed. note that the new types of RAM can be purchased for pretty cheap, so if you see a PC on sale for $300 that only has 1 GB of RAM, just know that you can buy another GB of ram from either amazon.com or buy.com for like $25 more

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JohnnyLaRue

JohnnyLaRue

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I am no PC guru but I know the old Desktop I have I wanted to upgrade but only certain types of RAM can be used with my CPU. I think the max compatible with my CPU (older HP) was not enough to get the 512 MB I wanted.

 

then again I dont play games on my CPU and just surf the net, chat and ummm trade stocks and check my email on my desktop PC. Probably not worth the upgrade for me.

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deelite

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i have a 7 year old dell dimension as my home PC that my mom uses primarily. it uses the same crap RDRAM that is tons more expensive than the newer stuff. it also had that annoying loud fan problem that seems to be common with the dell dimensions, but i managed to fix that with a new fan.

 

the only thing ive thrown at this pc is a larger hard drive that i got for free from my uncle, and some new RAM. right now, the PC runs like crap for anything other than basic internet and music. i just bought 256 MB more RAM from ebay for $17. im gonna install it this week - if it manages to improve the quality of this PC noticeably, i'll keep it. otherwise ill just spend the $300 or so for a new one on BF.

 

if your intention is to extend the life of the PC any more, i wouldnt bother. with most old PC's, you can throw on 1 or 2 gb of RAM , and it will fix things up quite a bit. with PC's that use RDRAM, however, it is too cost prohibitive to upgrade, and you're alot better off just buying a new one.

 

Edit - if you do get one with windows vista, make sure you have at least 2 GB of RAM installed. note that the new types of RAM can be purchased for pretty cheap, so if you see a PC on sale for $300 that only has 1 GB of RAM, just know that you can buy another GB of ram from either amazon.com or buy.com for like $25 more

 

I have noticed that it has started screaming, but I was not going to mention it. I know it is the fan but it does not seem to bother my son so nothing major. I tried cleaning it like I did with my other pcl but the way that it is made, it kinda of blew the dust deeper into the fan. Good to know that I am not the only one with a humming Dell. So because my pc is older the ram for it is so much more? I thought for a second that any ram could work, but I misunderstood. Rossman did say if it was a newer pc it would only run about $19 AR. You guys have been great, thanks so much. I am getting there, but still have not quite decided yet. Seems like it is almost not worth putting another band aid on this baby. We will see....:confused:

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shadowsjc

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I have noticed that it has started screaming, but I was not going to mention it. I know it is the fan but it does not seem to bother my son so nothing major. I tried cleaning it like I did with my other pcl but the way that it is made, it kinda of blew the dust deeper into the fan. Good to know that I am not the only one with a humming Dell. So because my pc is older the ram for it is so much more? I thought for a second that any ram could work, but I misunderstood. Rossman did say if it was a newer pc it would only run about $19 AR. You guys have been great, thanks so much. I am getting there, but still have not quite decided yet. Seems like it is almost not worth putting another band aid on this baby. We will see....:confused:

you can put any brand of RAM into the PC, but it has to be the same "type" of RAM as what came with it originally. the three main types of ram are: RDRAM (which is what your pc should have), DDR ram (the older 'standard') and DDR2 (the current 'standard', which is very cheap). you can't mix and match between them. the dell dimension that you mentioned should have RDRAM in it, which is the expensive kind i was talking about. it's not worth it IMO to put another band aid on the bugger, definitely not for $100 or whatever that 1 gb of ram was.

 

also as an aside, i've never had direct experience with an emachines pc before, but ive read that they're not terribly reliable. if i were you i would look into a more well known pc that's on sale on black friday; circuit city from time to time has compaqs or HP for as low as $300ish, so expect them to be around this or lower.

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len_mullen

len_mullen

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ive read that they're not terribly reliable. if i were you i would look into a more well known pc that's on sale on black friday; circuit city from time to time has compaqs or HP for as low as $300ish, so expect them to be around this or lower.

My three Vista Desktops are two HP refurbs and an emachine. One of each has upgraded video and all have upgraded power supplies. I've had to remove the heat sink from the cpu on BOTH HPs to apply thermal grease due to overheating (especially when encoding video, which I do a lot). The emachine achieves the same benchmarks while running a more efficient cpu and does not get hot at all.

 

All three came in terrific cases that are easy to open and work on. The HP case opens without tools. The biggest difference between the two machines is that on the HP, expansion cards sit between the psu and the cpu. On the emachine, the expansion cards sit at the bottom of the case. I believe this is the reason the emachine runs cooler.

 

No doubt I would pick the emachine (T5254) over the hp (a6112n). It is more efficient, produces less heat, and dissipates the heat better due to its superior design.

 

One more point. If you get to look inside the computer before buying, besides making sure it is a 'standard' configuration, notice how the cpu is cooled. Heat sinks don't fail, so the bigger the sink the less likely a failed fan will shut you down. I'd favor configurations where the path from the cpu to the psu is vertical and unobstructed (heat rises and good PSUs suck hot air out of your case).

Edited by len_mullen
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len_mullen

len_mullen

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After crapping all over my hp refurbs, I suppose I should not be posting this, but I like the HPs just the same and it looks like they solved the heat problem the same way I plan to -- by adding an exhaust fan at the bottom of the case.

 

- Price $299.99

- Operating System: Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium

- CPU: Athlon 64 X2 (W) 5600+ 2.8 GHz (89W)

- Memory: 3 GB PC2-6400 MB/sec

- Hard Drive: 500 GB SATA 3G (3.0 Gb/sec), 7200 rpm

- Optical Drive: 16X DVD(+/-)R/RW 12X RAM (+/-)R DL LightScribe

- Network: 56K modem, 10/100 ethernet

- Warranty: 90 Days

- Expansion slots

* PCI One (None available)

* PCI Express x16 One (One available)

* PCI Express x1 Two (Two available)

 

Link to manual for the curious

 

I'd still get the 9400gt video card and the thermaltake PSU.

 

This is a terrific gaming PC for $400.

Edited by len_mullen
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deelite

deelite

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After crapping all over my hp refurbs, I suppose I should not be posting this, but I like the HPs just the same and it looks like they solved the heat problem the same way I plan to -- by adding an exhaust fan at the bottom of the case.

 

- Price $299.99

- Operating System: Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium

- CPU: Athlon 64 X2 (W) 5600+ 2.8 GHz (89W)

- Memory: 3 GB PC2-6400 MB/sec

- Hard Drive: 500 GB SATA 3G (3.0 Gb/sec), 7200 rpm

- Optical Drive: 16X DVD(+/-)R/RW 12X RAM (+/-)R DL LightScribe

- Network: 56K modem, 10/100 ethernet

- Warranty: 90 Days

- Expansion slots

* PCI One (None available)

* PCI Express x16 One (One available)

* PCI Express x1 Two (Two available)

 

Link to manual for the curious

 

I'd still get the 9400gt video card and the thermaltake PSU.

 

This is a terrific gaming PC for $400.

I noticed how cheap that card is. How do you determaine which one works best with your pc? Or..can you use any one but of course with different results. In other words, what would make you pick that card over the more expensive ones? :confused:

 

BTW...Is this one that you are buliding yourself (at home per se), or on the website?

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len_mullen

len_mullen

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I have 8600gt cards in my gaming PCs right now. I paid $85 ea for these a year ago and that's still a pretty good deal. Video cards change very quickly and their prices plummet whenever something new comes out. Games lag video cards because game makers want to sell to the masses not just the thousand people with the latest, greatest card. When my kids want a game that does not do well on the 8600, I'll upgrade their cards and trickle these cards down to my other systems.

 

The 9400gt is not quite as good at the 8600gt, but it's very good compared to the cards people looking to buy a new PC on this thread are currently running. I was looking for something that was good but cheap and this fits the bill. I was also looking at something that could be added to the Fry's cart.

 

The 9400gt keeps the system price under $400 while providing a great gaming experience. We can shop for better video cards if you are willing to leave frys and maybe suffer additional shipping. I do like Thermaltake PSUs and 500w or 600w is plenty.

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BabyBear24kGold

BabyBear24kGold

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I Would Just Invest In A New One There Is Always A Cheap Model And A More Nice Model To Choose From On BF I Bought Me A New Hp 9340f With 6 Gig Memory 750 hd And A Nice GeForce 9500GS Video Card And I Got It For 700.00 For Cp Alone I Got It A Few Months Ago At Office Depot But It Is A Excellent Machine And No Upgrading For A While :)

 

 

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6700

• 6GB of DDR2 memory

• 750GB hard drive• Burns DVDs and CDs

• Built-in 802.11abgn wireless

• Built-in TV tuner

GeForce 9500GS

15-in-1 media card reader

Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium with Service Pack 1 (64-bit):

Blazing-fast wireless

DVD SuperMulti drive

Edited by BabyBear24kGold
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len_mullen

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I have 8600gt cards in my gaming PCs right now. I paid $85 ea for these a year ago and that's still a pretty good deal. Video cards change very quickly and their prices plummet whenever something new comes out. Games lag video cards because game makers want to sell to the masses not just the thousand people with the latest, greatest card. When my kids want a game that does not do well on the 8600, I'll upgrade their cards and trickle these cards down to my other systems.

 

The 9400gt is not quite as good at the 8600gt, but it's very good compared to the cards people looking to buy a new PC on this thread are currently running. I was looking for something that was good but cheap and this fits the bill. I was also looking at something that could be added to the Fry's cart.

 

The 9400gt keeps the system price under $400 while providing a great gaming experience. We can shop for better video cards if you are willing to leave frys and maybe suffer additional shipping. I do like Thermaltake PSUs and 500w or 600w is plenty.

No more integrated video for me. I just added an 8600gts plus 2g of ram to my 6112a for $20 AR. They also have a Thermaltake 500w PS for $35 AR.

 

If you missed out on the hp PC, check out the SR5610F for $350.

 

Not amazing deals just great prices on very good desktop computers.

 

PS EVGA has a 'step up' program that allows you to upgrade your card to a more powerful card down the road.

Edited by len_mullen
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