uscboy

I wish I could have picked up that Westinghouse 26" LCD HDTV on special this year... or the Syntax at CC maybe... would have made a better tailgating setup TV than my 17" Dell LCD HDTV. Maybe next year...

It doesn't take that long to walk along a line of 400-500 people handing out a ticket to each if that's the only thing that person is doing. Plus, most of the handout times (hourly) will be far fewer people. And since it stops at 4am, it wouldn't even be 400-500 probably at that point... maybe 300ish tops for the last ticket handout... and frankly, the people who are getting only the 4am ticket won't get a voucher anyway, it's just a way to prove someone stayed there the entire time and didn't just get an 11pm ticket and leave and come back. You have to have them all. At least I think this system would work out pretty well. Even just the barriers would help a lot, but the rest of this idea would stop line cutters and place holders since they won't give you a 2am ticket for somene you're holding a spot for.

At least you're making a decent point instead of arguing semantics over who's trying to prove what. I'm not here trying to prove anything. I'm making statements and at least you're addressing them specifically. Being in IT for a living, I understand the concept of what you're talking about... I don't advise anyone to get the latest and greatest in computer technology unless it's absolutely necessary. However, I don't see this as one of those situations. HD is already out there and I know that the big game won't look nearly as good on a 480p widescreen set as it will in HD... I know that because I've seen both many times. Doesn't have nearly as much wow factor. But some people seem to be getting caught up in certain words I'm using... maybe I'm typing too much in replies. But I think that people reading this can still get the info they need out of it to make a better decision. People will always pinch pennies... I love deals myself, but in this case unless you need plasma for one of the various few reasons that make it right for you, there are a lot better ways to go when purchasing a new television where you can still find a good deal. And sometimes finding an alternative that works out better can be a deal in and of itself. Occasionally it makes sense to spend a little more than the least you can get away with... this is one of those situations. And I believe that people with either agree with that when they have all of the information or they'll wish they had a couple years from now. Because when the prices on HD sets come down a couple years from now, you'll still end up spending more on an entire new set than you would have today on a better set. Most people who have seen the difference and actually have an HD set and know that there's a fair bit of programming out there already would tell you the same thing. Add to that the fact that it's the future and that TVs shouldn't be something you buy every other year, and I couldn't possibly advise someone to buy EDTV unless they absolutely had to have a plasma set and absolutely couldn't afford $400-$500 more. But there is a sizable market for them, it is a price point item. I'm just trying to save some people out there the problem of regretting their purchase when they realize how great HD is and that they don't have it.... it's not really that much more considering what they're already spending. Might as well do it right. Anyway, hope I helped some people. If you still think EDTV at this price or higher is a good deal, then for you it probably is a good deal... it's probably all you need, I'm just glad I'm not in your boat. And if you don't want to take my word for it, and you shouldn't take any one person's word for it with something this expensive, then just visit some A/V message boards like AVSForum and read and learn. The minority of people there will recommend EDTV versus HDTV and most of them do so while defending their own purchase of an EDTV.

Exactly. And honestly, other than needing it to hang on the wall or flat out refusing to spend the extra $400-$500, there really is not a reason to buy an EDTV versus an HDTV. $400-$500 more now... or a whole new set a year or two from now... or worse yet, once you realize you don't have HD and want it, since I think there's plenty of HD content currently to warrant wanting an HD set already. And that's before movies start coming out on HD DVD or BluRay when it's out and affordable (which will be within the next year or two). But anyway, I think we've all explained the technologies well enough for people reading this to have a better understanding of what's going on. If you just want an extra set and already have an HD set and you want a slick looking plasma for a gameroom or something, then this is a good deal. Otherwise, my advice is to spend a little bit more and get an HD set, DLP or LCD projection instead of buying a plasma set... especially if you're going to just put it on a stand anyway. :)

You have a 9 year old who is aware of how responsible and/or irresponsible she is in life? Wow. :)

Security should definitely be enforced. How about this too: Someone from the store hands out tickets as people arrive with the hour on them... ie, 11pm, etc. Each hour they go along and you get another ticket for the current hour... 12am, 1am, 2am, etc... Then at 5am before they open, they give one voucher max to each person (each body) in line with all of the tickets and so on and so forth. It would show who got there first (someone with 11pm through 4am) and it would show who stayed the entire time... in other words, if you have 11pm, 12am, 4 am and you don't have your 1am, 2am, and 3am tickets then you count as a 4am no matter where you stand in line. Also, add to that a barrier like this: http://uscboy.no-ip.org/post/blackfriday-plan.jpg Obviously that could be varied, just a quick sketch. That way there's no mob rush at the door at 5am, and with the ticket thing, it would be easy to tell who was really there first. If I managed a Best Buy or something like that I would certainly be looking into things like this for next year.

Because of detail. There's far more fine detail in real life than in even the best of video games.

That's a video game, man. Big difference. And if you don't see a big difference between 480p and 720p/1080i, then you're in the minority. To each their own I suppose. Not saying this set won't look good... And I'd say the difference between DVDs on an EDTV versus an HDTV (assuming an EDTV is better even) is much smaller than the difference between HD content on an HDTV versus an EDTV... you're going to notice one difference much more than the other because HD sets do a great job with DVDs also. The best arguments for EDTV are 'I can't afford anything more' and 'I don't care about HD'. Not the greatest arguments in the world. I'd bank the $1,000 and save for another month or so to get the rest. And not caring about HD is fine, I just can't personally understand it having watched a lot of HD over the last two years. Still has the wow factor when family and friends come over. Btw, on a side note, how much better are the graphics on the 360 than the old Xbox games? They have to look pretty stunning even at 480p widescreen.

Okay, forget about the 'dishonest' comment then if it bothers you that much. I've seen industry insiders shows where they bash manufacturers for making EDTVs, so I'm not alone in thinking that... but I don't care if anyone agrees with me there. Here are the key points: HD is already here - not a few years from now. And it's only going to get bigger. There is a good amount of HD programming each and every week. Plasma is a waste of money for most people. What I'm saying is that unless you have to hang your TV on the wall, you don't need to spend the extra for a plasma TV. Spend $400 more (not $800) and get a DLP or LCD set instead. So, that's $400 extra. Not $8000 total. I never said you'd HAVE to buy a BluRay player RIGHT NOW. In fact, I don't even think you can. And when you go to buy one, I can promise you they won't be $3,000. You sound ridiculous when you say that and put words in my mouth saying that I'm telling people that's part of the cost. HD DVD and BluRay players will be the same cost as mainstream players in a couple years. If people don't have the foresight to spend $400 more now so that they don't feel like they have to upgrade their televisions again very soon, then so be it. And even if you have to have plasma, $800 more when you're already spending a grand is still a good idea. And I don't know about you, but your point about 'a couple years' might seem like a good one to you if you're really pinching pennies to buy this TV, but personally I don't like to replace $1,000 items every couple years - and that's ignoring the fact that there's a lot of HD out there already! But by all means, save that $400 and get a 42" set instead of a 46-51" set so you can say you have plasma! Then when your friends have HD sets and watch the big games in HD and you have 480p, don't say I didn't try to help. You must work for a manufacturer... I'll bet they absolutely love selling tons of EDTV plasmas knowing most people don't need a plasma TV and that they'll turn right around and sell them an HD set once they realize what they're missing.

Receiving HD signals and 'doing' HD as we both said earlier are two totally different things. This set cannot display high definition content. It will downconvert it to 480p, which is not HD. Better? Tell you what, you buy the EDTVs and I'll buy HDTVs. That's fine.. you save a little bit of money. As more and more HD content is available the savings won't look nearly as good to you. And that's exactly what a price point is... offering a lesser product at a lower price. Like the Celeron compared to the Pentium. Except at least the Celeron can do pretty much everything the Pentium can do only slower... EDTVs are worse since they have something they cannot do. Case in point, I'm sitting here watching the Giants and Seahawks in HD. I've seen Fox broadcast in 480p widescreen (EDTV) before my local station upgraded their equipment to HD stuff... no comparison. Let me put it this way... I'm not talking about people who also have an HD set either... someone buys an EDTV now... they're either going to have to upgrade to view HD quality content or they're going to mistakenly think they have HD television, right? That point can't be argued, those are facts. So, at the point they realize they do not have HDTV, their only option is to purchase an HD set. There aren't many cases where an EDTV makes sense for someone IMO... the only two I can think of are the original poster's situation where someone has an HD set also, and someone who doesn't care about having HD television for XX number of years where XX = the number of years before they'll upgrade. Honestly, no one can say how much HD content there will be 2, 3, 4+ years from now... there's a fair amount now... I watch a lot of HD content, albeit I watch a lot of sports which might not be everyone's thing... But one thing that is certain is that 2, 3, 4+ years from now the amount of HD content will be greater than it is right now. Movies will start coming out on HD DVD and/or BluRay, more cable/sat channels will be available, etc... and the bottom line of this entire point I'm making is that anyone purchasing an EDTV will HAVE to upgrade their television and/or buy a second set that is HD compatible if they care to have HD television. I'm trying to tell people that it's worth $400 more (or $800 more if you really want to make "plasma" the point of emphasis - not necessary for most everyone) to upgrade and get an HDTV instead of an EDTV.

Already responded to you. You said that the 42" EDTV from Walmart could do HD. Wow. I think we're done. Buy your EDTVs... look me up in a couple years.

Digital.... not HD. Again, another example of the general public not understanding the technologies. Digital broadcasts CAN have HD sent over them, but don't have to be. In fact, most digital NBC, ABC, etc feeds are still 480i... standard TV signal, except the new transmitters broadcast digital information instead of analog (which takes up more frequency airspace). Don't think for a minute that every channel out there... FoodTV, CSPAN, TLC, History Channel, or even your local news on NBC, ABC, etc will be in HD by the end of next year.

All of the channels are not going to be HD by the end of next year, not by a LONG shot. Also: Unless you typed that in error, Bobby, you might want to stay out of AV technology discussions. EDTV means 480p max... that's NOT HD. 1+1=2. This TV cannot do HD. I'm not making this up.

I don't think rebate forms prohibit reselling it... you own the piece of hardware after you buy it. You just send them the receipt, bar code, etc... you could sell it, smash it, paint it pink, turn it into a potted plant, etc.... they don't know and legally couldn't do anything about it anyway. Buying it qualifies you for the rebate, not buying it and keeping it. Anyway, I didn't wait in line and flip items on Ebay, but if someone's willing to wait it out and that's their intention, I have no problem with that... it's legal and well within their right. Wish I would have remembered the 360 was coming out, I would have made sure to get one or two myself.

I'm not fighting any battles, I'm just saying why I think it's wrong. EDTV does not do HD. You don't have to spend $2000+ to get a good set that does... unless it's plasma, which frankly is a waste of money unless you HAVE to hang your TV on the wall... which if that's important to you or you have no other choice, fine... I know that TVs of any decent size are plasma if they're flat. But assuming that you don't HAVE to hang it on the wall, you could try all you want and not come up with a viable reason IMO why someone shouldn't spend $400 more and get a decent HD set that's 13"-15" deep and sits on a stand instead. If you showed someone HD content on one of those sets and then showed them it at 480p, $400 more wouldn't seem all that bad. Btw, they may plan on using it for minor HD viewing, but I'm fairly confident they'll use it for zero HD viewing since it can't do HD. Anyway, it doesn't matter... if even one person reads this who doesn't understand the difference between EDTV and HDTV and does now, that's great... that was the point all along. The people who already know and buy one anyway (because they have an HD set or don't care) were never my concern... it's their money they're spending after all. :)

Not sure, but even if it is true, HD = HD = HD... even downconverted to 720p or 1080i (if possible), it'll still look better than being downconverted to 480p. That's my main point. Yes, technology changes all the time, but EDTV screams price point to me and when HD gets big there will be people having to replace their 'expensive' sets to get real HD... or worse, they'll think they'll have real HD and they'll misrepresent it to others who also have no clue.

I know, I hit return. It's a habit from other boards. I kind of like it.

I had a 4-head HiFi VCR from them a few years back and it started eating tapes after about a year of very light usage. Not sure if that is representative of everything they make... probably not, but it pissed me off. :) But not too much... I mean, who watches VHS tapes anymore?

Not that I really care... all I'm trying to do is help people out. Fact of the matter is HD is the future... HD DVD, Blu Ray, and the already available HD broadcasts. The future is not 480p... and those DVDs will look just fine on an HD set. I agree this is a better set than an old 31" 480i CRT, all I'm saying is I wouldn't drop a grand on an EDTV personally and I listed the reasons why... that money could be better used when put towards an HD set of some sort. Besides, larger sized DLP and LCD HD sets are only $300-$400 more... only reason to pay more for a plasma really is if you absolutely have to hang it on the wall and need it to be flat. But, to each their own I suppose.

Wow, and even more of it here. EDTV < HDTV. I spend plenty of time over on AVS too and telling people EDTV is okay who don't fully understand it is just wrong. Someday they're going to want to watch HDTV and they won't be able to... or worse, they'll have this slick looking, flat TV and they'll get HD service and they'll be part of the problem by telling everyone they have HDTV. It's retarded. Now the original poster at least understands all this, but frankly, anyone who says that EDTV can look just as good as an HDTV set with even a semi- decent feed is a straight up moron. I've seen plenty of 480p in my life to know that even compressed 1080i looks a ton better. Bottom line? EDTV is adding to the problem of consumers not understanding television technologies. It should not be made or sold anymore, I consider it dishonest in a way.

Maybe because they are good deals even without the AOL discount?

Doesn't excuse it. It does make sense to go all the way around the building... you know... behind the people who were there before you... You, the other 100 people, and general for that matter for his worthless comment in this thread are the real losers. People like you are what's wrong with this world.

Easy solution... don't offer these deals online. You want a killer deal on a camera, wait in line with everyone else. Of course, it's too late... and since they gave you confirmation, they should honor it. Then next year, don't put anything online.

Nice. :)

Local channels via satellite services are compressed more than the other channels. They're still digital. Also, that set it an EDTV, right? No offense, but someone should outlaw EDTV... just don't get pissed off when you sign up for HD and can't do HD with that TV set.