149 replies to this topic

[josetann]

Well, no one's started this annual thread yet, figured I'll go ahead and get it going. Do you think it's ok for people to sell tickets for BF items? For example, say you're at Best Buy, get a ticket for the uber-cheap laptop, then sell it to someone in the back of the line for $50 (selling just the ticket, so they can go in and pay the BF price for that item). If you think there's something wrong with doing that, how do you feel about people who are in line because someone's paying them to hold their spot? I.e. they're getting paid $50 to stand in line overnight, then someone else takes their place shortly before the doors open. If you feel that's wrong too, then how about standing in line the entire time, buying the items you got tickets for, then throwing them up on ebay or craigslist? I know a lot of people think it's wrong to sell the tickets but perfectly fine to turn around and sell the item on ebay, since they had to put up the money and are taking a risk. I don't think that's really valid, because most places not only have a 30-90 day return policy, but will extend that policy starting on BF (basically you'd have at least a month past Christmas to return stuff). So you could put up a free ad on craigslist, if there were no takers just take it back for a full refund. Not a big gamble there. Personally I don't hoard tickets with the intent to resell. I get tickets for the items that I would actually buy (whether for personal use or to sell). We're talking a couple desktops, a laptop or two, that's about it. One year the person behind us had a bunch of tickets and was talking about how much they were going for in the back of the line. I'm no salesman but I figure, hey $50 cash for this ticket and I don't have to deal with selling the desktop, why not. I think I only sold one ticket in the back. I tell the guy who's behind us that he can go sell our other ticket and we'd split the money. I think my "cut" was $30 or $40. Since it was the ticket my sister was holding on to for me, I let her have it and she got an mp3 player and some movies. So...I'll continue to stand in line for BF and other big release items (when's that Xbox 720 due out?) with every intention of buying the items I get tickets for. If someone wants to pay me for my time in line, whether by actually swapping places or buying some tickets I have, I'll let them if the price is right. If no one buys a ticket (which generally no one does, as I'm not trying to hawk them, that one year was the exception so far) then I'll gladly go in and purchase those items.

[bigjimslade]

All I will say is last year at my local BB the manger has a man arrested for selling tickets. He was charged under the ticket scalping law and the manager had undercover BB loss prevention people in the line and that is how he was caught.

[len_mullen]

I think it's fine and ethical (I don't do it). If the stores don't want this, they should use a computer and scanner to associate tickets with a credit card or license. I'm much more offended by the friends who join placeholders in line just before the store opens. If you want to police something, police the first hundred spots in line.

[josetann]

Here in TN I don't think it's illegal to scalp tickets. Only thing I could find (and I'll do some more research, it's good to know regardless) is that it's illegal to circumvent security measures meant to limit how many tickets a person can get for an event. Doesn't seem to be illegal to resell, at least not in TN and only by what I've googled (so I could be wrong). Requiring a credit card or a driver's license wouldn't go over very well. For one, how could my sister get extra tickets for me (she's not even 16 yet)? What about people who don't have licenses (maybe a friend brought them) and no credit cards (cash is still as good as cash, for now)? I think a possible solution would be an RFID tag. Each person in line who wants a hot-ticket item gets an arm-band that can't be taken off without destroying it (and making it obvious that it was switched). The employees go down the line and ask them which of the hot-ticket items they want. Easy to set limits per person, and someone couldn't get a ticket for 12 different items and sell the tickets to 12 different people. They'd have to find one person who wanted all 12 items (and figure out a way to get the RFID armband off without making it noticeable). You can still have people in line getting extra "tickets" for you, but they have to be present when you checkout. Plus, it'd be harder to make counterfeit copies of the RFID chips. Heck, all you have to do now is take a high quality scanner like my Epson 4490 Photo, a nice color printer like my Epson Photo R1800, some different types of paper (never know what they might use this year), and...hrm...forget I said any of that....

[truexillusions]

I can see why people would have a problem with it, to be honest.

[josetann]

I can see why people would have a problem with it, to be honest.

True, but would you have a problem with the other similar scenarios? People getting paid for holding a spot in line, or people in line only to buy stuff to resell? Just curious, I know people who think all the scenarios are wrong.

[truexillusions]

I don't have a problem with any of it, really. But then, maybe it would be different if I was one of the people in line.

[Brad]

one thing they could do would be to have tickets for people, not for items. so if you are 8th in line, they ask which of the ticketed items (that would still have quantities available after the first 7 people made their selections) you want and they mark them all on your ticket (in some way that couldn't be faked/forged). that way you don't have a laptop ticket, a tv ticket, etc... that could each be sold, but rather a single ticket. sure someone could sell "their" ticket, but it would almost defeat the purpose of waiting in line if you would end up getting none of the hot items. it would also stop the people in front from taking tickets for every item, regardless of if they are going to buy them or not, just to sell later on to other people in line. but the employees are busy enough on that morning that it'd very unlikely any system like that would ever be feasible.

[happysunshine28]

A store could always stop the ticket system all together and have it where people have to quess where to go when the store opens and if they are lucky they find the item they wanted, so #100 in line who got there 1 hour before store opened lucked up and found where they were got it and #1 in line got nothing they wanted after camping out for 2 days all because the store didnt want people selling tickets.

[cherry33778]

Well I for one do not care if people sell their tickets. If they are willing to stay outside for 12-24 hours for these items then who's to argue? It's their time they are missing from their families, missing the turkey, cranberry sauce and stuffing. Furthermore, I don't understand how they could arrest somebody for ticket scalping since a ticket has no value. The store GIVES these tickets away. So if somebody gave you a present you didn't want, is it illegal to sell it? CRAZY

[josetann]

The "one ticket per person" idea could be doable now that I think about it. It'd be like the RFID system I proposed, but more low-tech. Just have a sheet of paper, empty spots for each hot-ticket item, and a sticker for each item. Use special security stickers that fall apart when you peel them off (you could use a blow-dryer, but it'd be freezing out already plus how many people bring a generator and a blow-dryer to BF?). At worst you'd have some people in the front of the line trying to swap stickers, but in the back of the line they wouldn't have the special paper to put the stickers on.

[josetann]

A store could always stop the ticket system all together and have it where people have to quess where to go when the store opens and if they are lucky they find the item they wanted, so #100 in line who got there 1 hour before store opened lucked up and found where they were got it and #1 in line got nothing they wanted after camping out for 2 days all because the store didnt want people selling tickets.

I know that our Circuit City store did that long ago. Not only that, but they'd let people buy items without having the item with them. It's just the way the system was setup them, most items like DVD players and VCRs and what-not were kept in back, you'd ring up the item and it'd be brought up front. On BF they'd just have stacks of the stuff, but some employees didn't know which items were in back and which were out on the floor, so they'd just ring up the item. Then you're left with two people claiming the same item; one's been holding on to it trying to check out, and the other's already paid for it and is just needing to pick it up.

The ticket system, however flawed, is better than the problems that could arise with the above scenario.

[bigjimslade]

Requiring a credit card or a driver's license wouldn't go over very well. For one, how could my sister get extra tickets for me (she's not even 16 yet)? What about people who don't have licenses (maybe a friend brought them) and no credit cards (cash is still as good as cash, for now)?

I know alot of BB do check ID's or DL's. Most states do issue ID's to minors and people who cant drive and she could get a ID. Most states issue ID's through the DMV. These days you do need a ID to travel, go to Canada or Mexico, enter Federal Buildings, open bank accounts and so on.

[josetann]

I know alot of BB do check ID's or DL's. Most states do issue ID's to minors and people who cant drive and she could get a ID. Most states issue ID's through the DMV. These days you do need a ID to travel, go to Canada or Mexico, enter Federal Buildings, open bank accounts and so on.

Unless they had in regular sized print in their ad that everyone had to have ID, it just wouldn't go over well. Sure, a 12 year old COULD get an ID, but do you know of many that do? And the ones that do, do they regularly carry it around with them?

[sgklee]

A store could always stop the ticket system all together and have it where people have to quess where to go when the store opens and if they are lucky they find the item they wanted, so #100 in line who got there 1 hour before store opened lucked up and found where they were got it and #1 in line got nothing they wanted after camping out for 2 days all because the store didnt want people selling tickets.

Yeah that would be great! Not! In my town the BB and Toysrus are right next to each other. I've gotten everything I wanted from BB and sold the tickets that I didn't need. My wife on the other hand was #5 in line at TRus and got none of what she wanted because an employee opened an Emergency exit for his buddies and they all got to the electronics section first. Me on the other hand made $350 selling my extra tickets at BB, to very thankful people who got to sleep all night long in their nice warm dry beds. I EARNED every dime! Why would the BB manager care about selling tickets? That $350 I got just went straight into his store!

[sgklee]

I know alot of BB do check ID's or DL's. Most states do issue ID's to minors and people who cant drive and she could get a ID. Most states issue ID's through the DMV. These days you do need a ID to travel, go to Canada or Mexico, enter Federal Buildings, open bank accounts and so on.

Why don't we just get the Congress to pass a law saying you have to have a microchip ID implanted in your body? Maybe when you're child is born they can implant it then?

[Illinoismom]

I think it's all wrong, selling tickets, selling specials on E-bay all stops hard working people likle myslef from getting items I have stood in line for,because people are greedy and price gouge,

[AnonE1]

I've gotten everything I wanted from BB and sold the tickets that I didn't need...Me on the other hand made $350 selling my extra tickets at BB...

Why did you take so many tickets if you didn't need them all?

Me on the other hand made $350 selling my extra tickets at BB, to very thankful people who got to sleep all night long in their nice warm dry beds. I EARNED every dime! Why would the BB manager care about selling tickets? That $350 I got just went straight into his store!

doesn't seem like the money you "earned" going back to the store justifies exploiting the ticket system and consequently depraving fellow human beings...and by exploiting I mean taking so many more tickets ($350 street value) away from the 5-10 people right behind you in line who have been waiting just as long as you have, only to sell them for your personal gain.

This is not meant to be a personal attack, nor do I have a better ticketing system to offer. But I can certainly empathize with people who are willing to wait in line for X hours, only to see the ticket that could have been theirs , go to someone who walks up at opening time with 50 cash in hand.

[Brad]

That $350 I got just went straight into his store!

those doorbuster items would have been sold regardless of if you sold the tickets or not, so that's not a valid justification...

[katiesmommy01]

I slept out at BB in Wilmington (one of the busiest that day in the country i've heard) the year before last to get the laptop for my mom and a new tv for me. I was about 50 in line when I got there...over 100 by the time the doors opened...not a damn thing was done about the line jumpers before tickets were distributed. Add to that the employee who told me that he did not have any more laptop coupons when he got to me, and then gave coupons for the laptop to people BEHIND me in line. I would suggest a ticket system just for the first 100 people in line, distributed during the night with their # rank in line. Then go through the line in the morning weeding out the line jumpers and "friends" who join in the AM. If people sell their line ticket and leave the line, fine (cause you still have the same # of people). THEN go through the line with the item tickets. This wouldn't be too hard to implement AND would make BF sooooo much more fair for the people who really spend the time out in the cold to get those items. JMHO

[Princess7915]

I think no matter what type of "system" a store comes up with there will always be people out there with nothing better to do than to find a way to manipulate it. I agree that I am more offended by the line jumpers and cutters than people who sell of door buster items on ebay. If you bought and item to resell then that's your choice not mine, just don't jump infront of me to do it. I do however think that stores need to be more enforcing of their own policy. Hand out tickets or don't - quit this crap of somtimes not starting with the first person in line or handing tickets to "every other" person. Don't open side or back door and screw over people wait in the proper place at main entrances. The list goes on of how the "buddy system" works if you have a friend who works at a store. We all know Best Buy is the worst offender which is why I no longer shop there not just on BF but year round. The stores are arrogant that shopers will always come and that's why Amazon.com is such a big business and growing every year.

[JohnnyLaRue]

Hey if people are that hard up for $$$$ to wait in line forever to sell tickets for a couple hundred bucks so be it. To be honest I have no clue how the ticket system works as I never have gone to a store that does that. I've had stores hand out maps but that is about it. From what I have read I would not mind having the ticket be linked to a photo ID. Or just do away with the ticket system. Or taking the 1st 100 people in line and holding a drawing. 50 of the first 100 get a ticket.

[bigjimslade]

Hey if people are that hard up for $$$$ to wait in line forever to sell tickets for a couple hundred bucks so be it. To be honest I have no clue how the ticket system works as I never have gone to a store that does that. I've had stores hand out maps but that is about it.

For more info on the ticket system at BB we have a special FAQ on it at the link below.

http://forums.gottad...ad.php?t=115158

[JohnnyLaRue]

Interesting though it seems the ticket defeats the purpose. If you can pick up the item until 11am yet not be allowed to leave the line what is the purpose? To prevent stampedes? I doubt it as I would think those without the tickets would now push and shove even more. My local stores do not use the ticket system (Thank goodness!). The stores in my area allow X number of people in the store at a time. When one leaves one more can enter. Much thanks for the FAQ as I should start asking which stores have the ticket system and avoid those stores.

[bigjimslade]

Interesting though it seems the ticket defeats the purpose. If you can pick up the item until 11am yet not be allowed to leave the line what is the purpose? To prevent stampedes? I doubt it as I would think those without the tickets would now push and shove even more.
My local stores do not use the ticket system (Thank goodness!). The stores in my area allow X number of people in the store at a time. When one leaves one more can enter.

Much thanks for the FAQ as I should start asking which stores have the ticket system and avoid those stores.

Welcome to the community!

The ticket system does prevent stampedes. You have to take the tickets to the customer service checkout to get your item as all ticketed items at BB are under lock and key. WM rolls out the item in the middle of the sales floor and that is where you get the riots.

The reason BB gives you until 11am to pick up your item as the wait time for check out at BB on BF is anywhere from 2-3 hours. I hope this helps.

[JohnnyLaRue]

I guess those who have a ticket are less likely to stampede but those without a ticket will still be crashing through the doors. Also handing out tickets makes those who have no intention of buying those items more likely to buy them (or the ticket to resell). If I was on the fence on say a HDTV and had a chance to guarantee the item I would get the ticket and then buy the HDTV. Not to mention allowing more than one ticket per person. If they allowed one ticket per person that would be fair. I guess if the places that use the ticket system have it working then obviously that is the best system for them. The Best Buy I went to on BF 2006 I was in and out within 40 minutes I want to say. Oh well, thanks for the heads up as I will avoid the stores that have tickets.

[arci122]

The "one ticket per person" idea could be doable now that I think about it. It'd be like the RFID system I proposed, but more low-tech. Just have a sheet of paper, empty spots for each hot-ticket item, and a sticker for each item. Use special security stickers that fall apart when you peel them off (you could use a blow-dryer, but it'd be freezing out already plus how many people bring a generator and a blow-dryer to BF?). At worst you'd have some people in the front of the line trying to swap stickers, but in the back of the line they wouldn't have the special paper to put the stickers on.

This is pretty much how our Kmart did it last TG. They gave you a ticket and wrote your name down on a piece of paper to match up with. I don't believe in scalping them right there in line, especially since I live in the NE and it is pretty cold up here on BF.

[Just Me]

I think it's all wrong, selling tickets, selling specials on E-bay all stops hard working people likle myslef from getting items I have stood in line for,because people are greedy and price gouge,

Isn't this what our economy is based on? People work devoting their time and then get paid for that time? Someone spent their holiday in line. They campedo ut and froze to be in the front then got paid by the people not willing to devote as much time. I don't see anything unfair about that. I only see people POed because they didn't get there as early. I sold tickets at BB last year. I was first in line with my husband and brother. We bought a TON of stuff and funded part of that stuff by selling tickets in the back of the line. We will most likely do it again this year. I used to sell on ebay but after the mess that was created the last few years by fake buyers and ebay not protecting the sellers I'm sticking to selling tickets in line for a little cash. That said I think $50 is extreme. I sell tickets for $5-$20 depending on how hot the item is. If you want the cheap laptop but didn't get there in time would you find it worth $20 more to get it? Many do.

[dad2trips]

I personally have not done it, but had many opportunities. People stand in these lines a long time and most do it because they simply can not afford regular pricing. Its just not right to scalp - and its illegal in Ohio!

[Crazy Mama]

I'm on the fence on this one. On one hand I see where it's a good way to earn some cash for time, IE - working But on the other hand nothing is more frustrating to someone in line than someone behind you getting something you came for in plenty of time had the ones up front just let it go if they didn't want it. UGH!